@matnel: i think you also thought this is scary - what are you exactly fearing?
pe3
commented on
posted to #OPEN200906.11.2009 (en)
Answering @pe3 on behalf of @troppone: things like "mob justice" based on skewed/partial/misinformation, for example. All information is partial information, one could say...
The jokuveli-book is still on my list... :/ I forgot the name of the author.
mace
commented on
posted to #OPEN200906.11.2009 (en)
@pe3 Well, openness is very paradoxical, we want organisations to give control to people, but we want to control our own data. These privacy things...like my electricity usage etc. great from the climate change point of view, but what next, everybody seeing whether I do sports enough? Do I have a right to "poor health" in the future...usual stuff ;)
Have you looked at the electricity meter at your home? We have one, it gives very concrete feedback of my electricity consumption (and i can publish it if i want to).
mace
commented on
posted to #OPEN200906.11.2009 (en)
@pe3 this "fear" and privacy discussion is going on in some other threads too
I think the "profile" based on the persons consumption would be a very limited one. It's just the input, and not the output. The reasons for the input (errors in measuring devices? water pipe leak?) would be missing etc etc.
@mace But you cannot transform it into contextual information (consumption in regards to time, how much is good/bad etc.). Seeing a meter is not understanding it.
The emergence of thinglinks and the possibility to talk with all the products we are using will give a technical possibility (RFID, unicode, barcode). We could collect information about our ecological footprint and store it in a personal consumption bank. Maybe we could use it as a base for tax paying?
@visualradio This is the direction I'd like to see. To encourage thinking beyond simple metering towards services that affect people and the environment.
@mace we have some meter system in the basement (never seen it), and in the apartments only an old board that doesn't tell me anything else but that it was installed many decades before I was born...
pni
commented on
posted to #OPEN200906.11.2009 (en)
@pe3: at the moment we work based on certain rules, that guide how we work. For example, the role of government is to secure our security (Hobbes' view). If we rebuild the basics of our society, what will happen to these rules. Can we actually break things and create an anarchy?
Secondly, from my own perspective. I don't like others to have my data. I have my own server infrastructure due to that. In cloud environments, I actually try to use system level limitation of my privacy - I don't publish Qaiku's that hit in area I want to secure.
@juhak bollocks. I recorded the reading every monday for 2.5 years and i can think of many ways to contextulize it. At that house we only had electronic heating, so usage in wintertime was manyfold etc etc
mace
commented on
posted to #OPEN200906.11.2009 (en)
Penn & Teller put it nicely in one of the Bullsh*t episode, can't remember the wording exactly, but something like that the society should be wiser that the individual. We get angry, emotional, emotions get in the way of rational thinking. A too "flat" democracy might be a euphenism for anarchy?
Privacy - should I think about the problem when I'm going to the shop? I'm not concerned about exposing me as a human being (a dynamic communication package) to friends and strangers. What are we afraid about? I know lots of fears - but really - why are we concerned about the privacy? Should I ask instead, how could I live a healthy and rich life? Privacy seems like hiding myself inside a box.
@mace Good that you did, but most people don't have the interest, time or skills to do that. In order to achieve real change, things need to be made more accessible so they can be used by crowds. Many times possibilities are not explored, because something just exists "if you see the trouble for it"
Yeah @mace, took note of that. I'm personally not a privacy freak, but conscious.
But I'm thinking that organizations are finding openness difficult because the people in the organizations fear that openness in organisation will perhaps lead to "_bad openness_" in their personal lives (i.e. privacy "misuse")
@juhak it's quite easy to read a numeric reading and write it down in a notebook. If a person cannot do that, the problem is somewhere else, like you mentioned.
mace
commented on
posted to #OPEN200906.11.2009 (en)
How many of us would agree publishing the data of our Internet traffic and use (a link to the piratism discussion about starting to monitor more effectively the internet traffic of households)?
